VCTF-[Id]-Interstice

[-Id- iot]

I notice you're reading this post, McShagger. Refresh it as I made some edits.

[McShagger]

Me and Jim were testing this map earlier yesterday. Its pretty interesting... Now, for the criticism:

The Biggest issue we had were the jump pads going across:
Blind navigation of the pads really sux.

There are so many pads, putting so marker as to where each one is would simply be too confusing. The pads are so close together you wouldn't know which one you were headed for. Though I suppose I can take a look at this

Even if you "ride" the pads without moving, sometimes you get boosted off to your death.

I have tested this map so much that I can factually say that if you truly do not touch a single movement key while jumping, 95% of the time you will make it across safely, but there is nothing that can be done about the other 5%. I used to miss the jump pads a lot more often than I do now, and I haven't changed a thing since my latest tests. This is something that will have to be dealt with any time one jump pad leads to another. If you move too much you'll miss the next jump pad, so there is no reason to move; however, if a jump pad were to just lead to some place on the ground or to a higher level, sometimes moving while in the air can place you in a more advantageous spot. It is not advantageous to move so much that you miss the next jump pad in a string of jump pads, so whether this was fixed or not, moving while on the pad will in no way help you as it does not get you to the next pad any faster. Instead you should be focusing on where the enemies are so you can use your shield to block their shots.

Yeah, I tested each one in both directions about 2 x each and I got thrown off 3 times. You cant tell me that is just 5%. If you must "ride" it blind I expect 100%. Otherwise, its just plain ghey.

You cant tell where the pads are that are giving you a boost. Need to be able to see exactly where you are supposed to land to hit the next pad.

See my first point.

Very slow moving so very easy to snipe... I understand that you wanted it that way, but it is way to easy to shock someone off the pads. Maybe, the shock rifle can be put on the very top by the raptor. You can still put people off balance with other weapons.

I used to have the pads so fast even I could rarely hit someone using them. I had to slow them down and I had Badasp help me test the speed. The speed is slow enough that a person can get shot, but fast enough that they aren't exposed for too long, especially if they are using their shield as they should be. Also, if you don't like how many jumps it takes to get across, there are ten jumps when you use the middle pads, but only five or six (I think five) when you use the side pads. The difference is, the middle pads change your direction more frequently making you harder to hit, but the side pads change your direction less frequently, due to there being less jumps, making you easier to hit. They both get you across and about the same amount of time.

Too many jumps. Please, reduce it by two.

The more the jumps are reduced, the easier you are to hit. The time it takes to get from one side to the other is not longer than the amount of time you can hold your shield before its power runs out. A player should always have his shield out to protect him when using the pads.

What good is a shield gun going to do for you if the slightest tiny hit sends you falling to your death? I suggest you make it so you can see where the next pad is so we can have some control of making it over the jump pads. If you want to trust that having your shield gun out will get you to the other side, that would be up to the player.... but Id rather be checking for the pads to insure that I make it across without falling to my death. Listen, I like the idea here, its just that it seems too impossible... Anyway, its so slow that anyone could easily shoot them off the jump path to their death with just about any weapon.

Jump pads do not show direction. I would like to see direction of the boost.
Color of pads do not seem to matter. Make it matter or make them all look the same.

I'm not sure what you're talking about. Do you mean the red and blue static meshes that span the interstice? Those aren't jump pads. They're just something I added for visual effect (which I don't do much of). It also serves a base identifier. As far as direction goes. I know the jump pads I use don't show direction, but after you play a map enough, can you really say you pay attention to the direction indicator more than you just remember where the pad will take you?

Okay, I see... I thought they had more reason than that. And yes, I pay attention to direction as best I can, especially when there are that many jump pads. I still want to be able to see the jump pads and direction they take you...

Also, a few pads did not work or sent you someplace that doesnt matter.

I know which pads you're talking about. They do work. They are used as a means of safely dropping down from above. If you drop onto those pads instead of hitting the ground, you will lose no health for dropping. Check my second post that included screenshots to see a further explanation of this.

Outside paths are too much of a PITA (not difficult) and long to navigate to lead anyone ever actually use them. Make them easier to navigate and people might go out that way... otherwise, its wasted space.

I'll be using them a lot. Primarily as a low resistance means of reaching the enemy base, which ensures I'll have plenty of health when I attempt my flag run. As well as that, those side paths are the for people to use who don't want to use the jump pads, but the draw back is that it takes longer to reach them then just using the pads. I figured I'd leave in some way for flag carriers to go from base to base without jump pads. That's not what the map was made for, thus I will not make that path any easier to use.

I seriously doubt that people will use them the way it exists. Especially, the flag runner... A sniper can see all the way down the path... The flag runner must pay attention to his foot path and let himself be sniped (no sheild and he will be very easy to snipe) or risk a fall to his death... All the action is in the bases... not outside... Im sorry to say, it will be a waste of space as it exists now.

[tape`]

ive yet to try it out, ill prolly jump on the server tonight....

[McShagger]

I used to have the pads so fast even I could rarely hit someone using them. I had to slow them down and I had Badasp help me test the speed. The speed is slow enough that a person can get shot, but fast enough that they aren't exposed for too long, especially if they are using their shield as they should be. Also, if you don't like how many jumps it takes to get across, there are ten jumps when you use the middle pads, but only five or six (I think five) when you use the side pads. The difference is, the middle pads change your direction more frequently making you harder to hit, but the side pads change your direction less frequently, due to there being less jumps, making you easier to hit. They both get you across in about the same amount of time, but I think the side pads have a slighty faster travel time.

OMG, was it that many? Im sorry, I was thinking two or three, but then I thought, three was too much, so I just said two... Can I change that to "Reduce by 3-5"? Anyway, I was trying to figure out where I needed to land and didnt bother counting... I knew there were a lot...

[-Id- iot]

What good is a shield gun going to do for you if the slightest tiny hit sends you falling to your death? I suggest you make it so you can see where the next pad is so we can have some control of making it over the jump pads. If you want to trust that having your shield gun out will get you to the other side, that would be up to the player.... but Id rather be checking for the pads to insure that I make it across without falling to my death. Listen, I like the idea here, its just that it seems too impossible... Anyway, its so slow that anyone could easily shoot them off the jump path to their death with just about any weapon.

You kind of make my point for me, if it's so slow that you can easily be shot off, then why would you want to be searching for the next jump pad instead of holding your shield blocking shots?

Yes you can be shot over or under the shield, but it is not easy to do, especially when you're bouncing around on jump pads. Trust your shield gun. Also, think of it this way, if someone decides to hang back and try to shoot you as you use the pads and they miss (which is more than likely if you use your shield), then you have a free path home because they are so far behind now they can't catch up.

The main point to make here is this: The jump pads are designed to shoot you into the next jump pad without you having to do anything, so you looking for the next jump pad in order to hit it is a complete waste of time. Like I said, instead, you should be facing your enemy with the shield blocking their shots. If you turn your back on a person standing there shooting at you, you greatly increase their chances of hitting you.

Two jump pads isn't much more than just one. What fun is the map if you just take a string of two jump pads over to the other side? May as well just let people walk across.

I haven't tested this too much, but I believe there are no weapons I included in the map other than a Shock, Rocket, Flak, Redeemer, Shield Gun, AR Grenades and the Bio Rifle that can knock you off your path to the next jump pad, and realistically, only the Shock Rifle is going to be a feasible weapon to use in that situation. Good thing is, the Shield Gun completely absorbs Shock Rifle shots.

Like I said about the side paths, they're supposed to be more difficult to use. I wasn't going to have any way possible to walk from base to base in this map, but I figured people would throw a fit over that. I added a walk path anyway, but definitely didn't want it to be so easy to use that the jump pads get bypassed completely, otherwise, why did I put the jump pads in in the first place?

McShagger, will you hop in the map with me sometimes and let me show you why I did what I did? We can also do some further testing. I've already done this with a few people. I'd like to get the opportunity to show you and anyone else how the map works and why it works that way too.

[McShagger]

What good is a shield gun going to do for you if the slightest tiny hit sends you falling to your death? I suggest you make it so you can see where the next pad is so we can have some control of making it over the jump pads. If you want to trust that having your shield gun out will get you to the other side, that would be up to the player.... but Id rather be checking for the pads to insure that I make it across without falling to my death. Listen, I like the idea here, its just that it seems too impossible... Anyway, its so slow that anyone could easily shoot them off the jump path to their death with just about any weapon.

You kind of make my point for me, if it's so slow that you can easily be shot off, then why would you want to be searching for the next jump pad instead of holding your shield blocking shots?

Did you read the first sentence in my post? You dont have to hit the head or the legs... just hit the shield and you knock you opponent off the path to their death. Holding the shield out does nothing for on these jump pads.

Yes you can be shot over or under the shield, but it is not easy to do, especially when you're bouncing around on jump pads. Trust your shield gun. Also, think of it this way, if someone decides to hang back and try to shoot you as you use the pads and they miss (which is more than likely if you use your shield), then you have a free path home because they are so far behind now they can't catch up.

Again, if you get hit, holding the shield gun out does nothing for you, especially if you cannot move.

I haven't tested this too much, but I believe there are no weapons I included in the map other than a Shock, Rocket, Flak, Redeemer, Shield Gun, AR Grenades and the Bio Rifle that can knock you off your path to the next jump pad, and realistically, only the Shock Rifle is going to be a feasible weapon to use in that situation. Good thing is, the Shield Gun completely absorbs Shock Rifle shots.

The shield gun does not completely absorb a shock rifle shot. If you get shot in the shield you will get knocked back. Moreover, other weapons have a shock effect too. Ive knocked people off a jump pad path with the LG, flack and rockets. Im sure other weapons will do this too. For sure grenades will do it.

Like I said about the side paths, they're supposed to be more difficult to use. I wasn't going to have any way possible to walk from base to base in this map, but I figured people would throw a fit over that. I added a walk path anyway, but definitely didn't want it to be so easy to use that the jump pads get bypassed completely, otherwise, why did I put the jump pads in in the first place?

McShagger, will you hop in the map with me sometimes and let me show you why I did what I did? We can also do some further testing. I've already done this with a few people. I'd like to get the opportunity to show you and anyone else how the map works and why it works that way too.

I understand why you did what you did, but Im just telling you how it is... its too frustrating. In the end, the best way (and probably the ONLY way I will be using) to get from base to base is by scorpion. #2 would be the raptor.

[-Id- iot]

Did you read the first sentence in my post? You dont have to hit the head or the legs... just hit the shield and you knock you opponent off the path to their death. Holding the shield out does nothing for on these jump pads.

I haven't noticed this. Again, hit the map with me and we can do some more testing. If you have XFire, you can PM me if you're interested and I'll give you my contact. I actually do want to test the Shock on the shield now because I haven't noticed the Shock bumping people around.

[-Id- iot]

Mr. Bean, does zoning only occlude the rendering of static meshes? I didn't use any static meshes in this map except for those lights in the middle of the map, so if it only occludes static meshes, I'm not sure if I need to do any zoning.

[CTC-JimRimya]

Mr. Bean, does zoning only occlude the rendering of static meshes? I didn't use any static meshes in this map except for those lights in the middle of the map, so if it only occludes static meshes, I'm not sure if I need to do any zoning.

IIRC, zoning occludes everything. And remember, vehicles, players, projectiles and lockers are meshes.

[-Id- iot]

Thanks, Jim.

McShagger and I tested the Shock vs. Shield Gun thing. The Shock Rifle does not bounce a player when the Shock shot hits the shield. Trust your Shield Gun people.

[McShagger]

I could swear holding the shield gun out has helped me get away when it got hit (in other words, it give me a small bump away from the attacker)... I guess I was mistaken.

[tape`]

im gonna be straight up with you, I THINK THIS IS YOUR WORSE MAP YET....

i cant even tell you how to make it better..

/DELETE


no pun intended

[Mr Bean]

im gonna be straight up with you, I THINK THIS IS YOUR WORSE MAP YET....

i cant even tell you how to make it better..

/DELETE


no pun intended

Creatively, it's great. Fun factor... it's not my cup of tea either. His last two maps however I do have fun with. Rome wasn't built in a day, but Id is well on his way. Sign me up for his fan club

[ru_exp]

im gonna be straight up with you, I THINK THIS IS YOUR WORSE MAP YET....

i cant even tell you how to make it better..

/DELETE


no pun intended

I hated this map the first time I played it...

But after taking a closer look at it and working with it I kind of like it. Id used his imagination and a bit of a chemical push. The jump pads just threw me off...

[v0idNull]

im gonna be straight up with you, I THINK THIS IS YOUR WORSE MAP YET....

i cant even tell you how to make it better..

/DELETE


no pun intended

Creatively, it's great. Fun factor... it's not my cup of tea either. His last two maps however I do have fun with. Rome wasn't built in a day, but Id is well on his way. Sign me up for his fan club

Does this mean that we can start removing his first maps that sucked?